Subaru Forester 2003 -2005

[Valiant]

Good day guys,

My apologies for writing in English. I am South African (Afrikaans) so you are very welcome to reply in Dutch. I just did not want to write in Afrikaans...or my version of Dutch as it will create too much laughter

I recently moved to the Netherlands for work with my family and we are looking for a nice car on a budget that is very reliable (or as close to that as possible). Also being from Africa I just have this inclination to still own some sort of 4wheel drive
The Subaru Forester is therefore number 1 on my list, with maybe something like a more boring Toyota avensis as second.

Not knowing the condition of these cars that old over here I am turning to the forum for some advice. I already read quite some discussions and learned a lot.

So here we go.
1. I will link some adverts that I have seen in the last week or two. the cars look optically very good and all have BOVAG on top with a decent amount of km's. Would you aim for something like that as minimum? Or am I being too conservative with my selection criteria? I think some of the Dutch blood in me is asking if one can find a "oerdegelijk" Subaru for 5000 bucks or less?
2. Up till which mileage would you look for without having sleepless nights about reliability. (150 000, 175K or even 200K)
3. How would you describe the car as a family car for holidays etc? (We are a family of 3).
4. What is the typical minor and major service costs? Do you prefer to service at the Subaru dealer or the local service centre?
5. What would be typical highway fuel consumption for the 2.0 X? I presume the XT is sucking like there is no fuel crisis?
6. Is the auto box on this worth to get or should I rather miss it? I prefer manual but one might get a good sample that has the auto box.

In closing I am looking for a reliable family car. We will do max 15K per year with it. I will do some highway driving to work (Leiden to Amsterdam) every now and then while for the rest my wife might use it for shopping. Lastly it would be nice to have a car that you would trust taking with you to Italy/France/Germany for holiday.

http://www.autotrack.nl/tweedehands/sub ... r/10845135

http://www.autotrack.nl/tweedehands/sub ... r/10703791

http://www.autotrack.nl/tweedehands/sub ... r/10632609


Looking forward to your answers and my apologies for the many questions! scientist...and OCD

[Maver]

Hello,
I suppose that the dealers of Subaru 2 and 3 are reliable. Number 1 I don't know!
But I should prefer a dealer in the environment of Leiden(I understand that is the place where you live)because of guarantee and keeping in repair.
Good luck with finding a car you like.
Greetz,
Maver.

[Valiant]

Hello,
I suppose that the dealers of Subaru 2 and 3 are reliable. Number 1 I don't know!
But I should prefer a dealer in the environment of Leiden(I understand that is the place where you live)because of guarantee and keeping in repair.
Good luck with finding a car you like.
Greetz,
Maver.

Thanks for the answer Maver! Appreciate it. I agree with finding a car in the Leiden area. But it seems quite difficult to find these cars in my region...? Depending on how low with the price I should go...hehe.

Greetings,

Francois

[the dude]

Hallo Francois. Welkom op dit forum en wat mij betreft mag je best in het Hollands schrijven.
Het is allemaal zo serieus hier, een beetje lachen kan toch geen kwaad?

Van mij hoef je geen advies te verwachten. Ik weet alleen maar van t oude spul een heel klein beetje. Ik vind wel dat je een goede keus hebt gemaakt Door voor de Subaru te kiezen.

Succes met zoeken.

[Verzamelaar]

What a useless comment. Did it ever cross your mind that the TS may not speak Dutch?!? If you don't have something to add don't respond instead of reacting just for the sake of it.

Luckily there are members like Maver.

[SP-Boxer]

I am South African (Afrikaans) so you are very welcome to reply in Dutch. I just did not want to write in Afrikaans...or my version of Dutch as it will create too much laughter

Ik moet het hier toch even voor Jan opnemen. Jan is de ENIGE van de reacties die het bericht van de TS goed gelezen heeft!
Welkom hier en veel succes met de zoektocht naar een Forester!

[the dude]

Ik wilde een wat stekelige opmerking weerleggen in een even stekelige reaktie, doch SP Boxer was me even voor met zijn "reply".

Sorry, couldn't ressist

[Valiant]

Bedankt voor al de opmerkings over mijn Engels, Nederlands en Afrikaans

Nou goed dan in afrikaans:

Baie dankie vir al die opmerkings. Ek waardeer dit. Maar ek hoop tog dat iemand vir my konstruktiewe advies kan gee aangaande die aankoop van 'n Subaru Forester. Ek weet dat ek dalk heeltemal te veel vrae het, en alles hoef nie in een slag beantwoord te word nie. Ek sal graag wil begin met die vraag:
Dink julle dis moontlik om 'n goeie eksemplaar Forester te kry vir ongeveer 5000 euro? Of moet ek liewers na 7000 kyk waar die aanbod beter lyk.

Verder het ek nog nie ernstig geloer na die eerste generasie van 1998 tot 2002 nie. Is hulle nog enigsins die moeite werd om te koop?

Byvoorbaat dankie, (Alvast bedankt, hehe)


Francois

[Verzamelaar]

Met kleine(re) kinderen is een Forester als familieauto groot genoeg, maar als de kinderen wat ouder/groter worden (en dat kan natuurlijk met hollandse genen ) vind ik de Forester achterin te klein worden. Wat dat betreft is een Outback of Legacy TouringWagon een betere keus.

Ik denk dat je qua prijs geluk moet hebben.

[eduard]

Met kleine(re) kinderen is een Forester als familieauto groot genoeg, maar als de kinderen wat ouder/groter worden (en dat kan natuurlijk met hollandse genen ) vind ik de Forester achterin te klein worden. Wat dat betreft is een Outback of Legacy TouringWagon een betere keus.

Ik denk dat je qua prijs geluk moet hebben.

Wellicht geldt dit voor het model tm 2005. Rijdt zelf in model bj 2009 maar vindt de ruimte groot genoeg voor de wat langere mensen, genoeg hoofd en been ruimte. Mijn zoon is inmiddels bijna 2 meter en houdt het achterin nog uit.
De outback zal misschien een fractie meer beenruimte hebben.

Kies je voor de Forester, outback of legacy.....tja zijn toch totaal verschillende wagens, ... Zowel rijgedrag als op het oog. Dat wordt keuzes maken.

[erichendri]

Eduard, jouw model forester valt buiten het budget.

Eric

[Valiant]

Goeie dag allemaal,

Ek het die volgende twee auto's in my omgewing gevind:
http://www.autoscout24.nl/Details.aspx? ... rc=st|s,sr
Die een is binne fiets afstand van my. Alhoewel ek die prys heeltemal te hoog vind, is dit mmiskien 'n goeie geleentheid om eers 'n Forester te gaan toetsbestuur. En mens kan sekerlik altyd die prys onderhandel.

Die volgende is 'n kort bus rit weg.
http://www.autoscout24.nl/Details.aspx? ... rc=st|s,sr
Die km stand is skrikwekkend laag....vir 12 jaar is dit nie eers 7000km per jaar nie. Kom wel met BOVAG garantie. Op die fotos lyk hy wel goed. Is nie X of comfort editie nie, maar het wel meeste dinge die ek in belang stel.

Dan iet verder uit (bus):
http://www.autotrack.nl/tweedehands/sub ... r/10590299
Sonder garantie en dan ook nog met turbo....
KM stand is hoog, maar wat ek al agtergekom het op die forum is dat 200K nie 'n probleem is nie. Tog? Tien teen een is die distribusie ketting vir die tweede maal vervang.
Wat is stad en snelweg benzine verbruik op die turbo? Ek is bang ek geniet hom te veel...

Die volgende is in Den Haag: Relatief naby.
http://www.autotrack.nl/tweedehands/sub ... er/9144287
Prys is weereens bietjie hoog. Maar dalk goeie geleentheid om te gaan kyk aangesien ek dan my variasie aan modelle in die prysklas kan toets.

En laastens 'n buitekans:
http://www.autoscout24.nl/Details.aspx? ... &asrc=st|s
Dis wel 'n groot investering in tijd en transport. Maar dis ook weer 'n goeie prys vir 'n Outback. Groter kar...en vol mooi opsies...en BOVAG.

Enige advies en raad is welkom. Julle het meer ervaring as ek met Subaru :P

Groete,

Francois

[Tripled]

Als je tijd hebt zou ik eens gaan kijken bij een dealer in de buurt.
De Outback en de Forester rijden heel anders.
Kijk wat je fijn vindt.
Maar ook de Forester turbo en non turbo hebben een heel ander karakter.
Rijden dus en dan prioriteiten stellen, wat rijdt het leukste en wat ben je bereid te betalen. Dan een goede auto uitzoeken

[Valiant]

Goeie dag,

I hope you do not mind that today I write in English instead of Afrikaans....I think I can express myself a bit better.
The good news is that I have managed to find - what I think - a good deal on a Subaru Forester end 2002 model with only 85 000km on the clock. The dealer is BOVAG and he imported it from Gent. I laid my hands on it after a test drive for 5 500 euros. I hope the attachments work so you guys can see it.

Now the dealer is not without his problems (Ter Duin - Katwijk). So this is where I would like to have some advice. During the test drive I noticed a few things:
1. that the clutch (koppeling) was a bit stiff
2. There is a rattling noise (the closest I can describe is like a loose pipe or loose exhaust) when the car passes 1500rpm and then disapears. You can also hear it well if you floor the gas pedal in any gear. In other words, if you drive normally/decently then you do not hear it except maybe quickly at low refs.
3. I could not find any evidence that the distribution belt was replaced at any time point in the book, or even a sticker in the hood.

The dealer however promised that he would take a look at these things for me and if a new distribution belt is needed he would put one on. All these points were noted on the sales agreement. Although wording of the distribution belt was more like - determine if it needs replacement.

I collected the car and the dealer said that all points were taken care of to his knowledge - after I asked if these things were fixed. BUT - he told me, I am lucky since the Subaru Forester does not have a distribution belt but a chain - i.e. no maintenance.

I thought maybe I made a mistake that this specific model had a belt - but of course coming home it was indeed clear that it had a belt. The mechanic that should have serviced the car should have noticed it I would assume.

So I decided to drive the car for a few days to work and back to see if it runs fine. And indeed: the rattle mentioned in point one was still there. The clutch felt roughly the same, although when warmed up it was smoother. I did not feel any slippage of the clutch though. I now also noticed a whining noise (sounds like the transfer case or Diffs of a Land Rover if you know what I mean). This noise is even there when you are rolling in neutral....which gives me a differential kind of idea. Bearing? I did not notice it before, but then again I was probably pre-ocupied with the rattle I heard.

Well...I phoned the dealer today and asked him if he still thinks the car has a chain. He said yes that is what the workshop told him. I said - no way it has a belt and I checked myself. Long story short he agreed with me that the belt needs to be replaced every 7 years or 105 000km. BUT, the fact that there was no evidence of a belt replacement in either the engine bay, inside of the car or even the books it does not mean it was not done.
And in theory if it was replaced at 7 years then the belt should go for 2 more. However, to accommodate me in peace of mind we can split the cost of a new belt installed. He quoted 260 in all so my contribution would be 130....what would you say? I asked about BOVAG, but he said he is sure the belt must have been changed so this is not a requirement. When I told him about the whining sound he said I should realise I bought an old used car. And he then complained that I am paying so little for the car that he is going to lose profit if he fixes too many things. I mentioned that the radio/cd player died on the second time I switched it on and that the other problems were not attended to. At least I did not get a report back that said they found the origin of the noise/rattle and that it was not serious....or otherwise.

What keeps me sane is that the car is under 6 month BOVAG warranty. But the dealer is pissing me off. Is this normal???? What would you do?
I was thinking of calling the Subaru dealer in Alphen aan de Rijn. Do you think one can organise that they check the car for me to see what is wrong or give their opinion? Any idea of the costs involved?
OR, should I fork out 200 or more bucks and take the car to ANWB for a full keuring and then take that report to the dealer? For now I have an appointment to replace the distribution chain, and to attend to my other complaints for next week Wednesday (19 Mrt).

Sorry for the long message but I wanted to be as clear as possible. And to of course have your valued input. Please also feel free to type in Dutch. I read it very well as usual

Hope the pics attach and that I can hear from you soon,

Francois

[Verzamelaar]

BOVAG warranty is BOVAG warranty. I'm not sure that maintenance which was not done in the past actually is included in that warranty. But I guess for 130 euros you cannot complain.

The rattling noise probably are heat shields which have come loose a bit, that's common. Regarding the stereo, that's an accessory which normally is not covered under warranty - maybe it's an idea to spend some money on a decent new unit with Bluetooth/handsfree compatibility?

Good luck with the car!

[erichendri]

Goede proefrit maken en vragen of je bij de subaru garage de auto mag laten nakijken.
Kost je misschien 100 euro maar dan weet je wel wat er aan mankeert.
De ANWB keurig is ook een goede keuring.
Koppeling stiff, als hij zwaar gaat kan het betekenen dat hij bijna versleten is.
Ik vind de kleur wel mooi.

Eric

[Valiant]

Thanks for the feedback guys.
As far as I understand the BOVAG guarantee covers all problems that were originating from before the car was bought (noticed or unnoticed) as well as any that develop in the 6 month period. Of course the radio is one of those things that are not covered and I agree one can get a decent new one including bluetooth etc for 80 euro.

However, I find it shocking (to say the least) that
1. a dealer claims the car I bought has a timing chain and not a timing belt (despite being a so called specialist in Subaru).
2. the dealer claims he fixed the clutch and checked the car overall when nothing seems to have been done or checked.
That includes the complaint about the rattling noise. Of course, if it is indeed the heat shield (which I also told the dealer at the time) he promised to have a look at it. They first told me everything was checked and fixed when I picked up the car. When I phoned to ask why I still hear it, they claim not to have heard it during their checkup....

These issues were noted on the sales contract. In other words, they were a prerequisite for the sale of the car. I chose for a BOVAG dealer because of the safety of the guarantee.

So....considering that it seems to me this dealer likes to lie to me, would you trust any work done by them?
Indeed, I am pretty much in the mood to take the car for a thorough check at a Subaru dealer after I get it back. And then they better hope they fixed and checked everything that is reasonable.
I am not expecting a brand new car, but I DO expect a car in working condition with no serious components close to failing or replacement.

And indeed...the car drives otherwise very well. Great handling and smooth ride. Very versatile, good space and I think it will otherwise be a great car.
Still getting about 10.5 km/L on average with 30% town and 70% highway.

And yes The color is also great. Subaru blue